Admin
The bread rises, but falls inward. The reasons that the bread falls off.


Diagnosis: The bread rises well and quickly, but at the end of the second proofing period or at the beginning of the baking cycle, the top-dome of the bread falls off.

Why does bread fall off in a bread maker or oven?

There are the following main reasons:
1. Increased increase in the volume of the dough piece, high yeast content.
2. Increased moisture content in the dough piece, non-observance of the flour / liquid balance.
3. Wrong choice of baking program, time of first or second proofing, depending on the type of dough. This factor is called "the dough has stopped"
4. Increased temperature inside the x / oven during proofing of the dough.

1. Increased increase in the volume of the dough piece.

The following factors contribute to an increased increase in the dough piece:

1. Basic: Too much yeast is added when kneading the dough, more than the standard setting.

2. When kneading the dough, there is a greater amount of sugar than provided by the standards for laying and is necessary for the dough to rise. Excess sugar greatly affects the action of the yeast.

3. When kneading the dough, salt is not included, or is included in a smaller amount. The salt controls the rise of the dough and prevents it from rising too high.

4. The bread maker is standing in a draft, or was moved or shaken while proving the dough.

5. The dough was kneaded in too hot weather, or at high temperatures in the kitchen. Here, the room temperature is superimposed on the heating temperature of the bread machine when kneading and proving the dough. When the room temperature is over 27 * C, the products are placed in a bucket from the refrigerator.

6. When kneading the dough into the bread maker, pre-heated foods were placed too much (water, milk, butter, hot mashed potatoes, etc.), which was superimposed on the heating temperature of the bread machine during the kneading and proofing of the dough. The overall temperature was higher than that for proofing.

7. Excessive proofing time of the dough before baking than is necessary for this dough recipe. The bread maker cannot independently visually control the time and degree of readiness of the second proofing of the dough piece before baking.

2. Increased moisture content in the dough piece.

The following factors contribute to the increased moisture content in the dough piece:

1. Basic: Too much liquid was added when kneading the dough. Liquid is a combination of water, juice, eggs, and other liquid products such as cottage cheese, mashed potatoes, and others.

2. During kneading, too much cheese was added to the dough, which melted and added excess liquid when the bread machine was heated.

3. Too much humidity and warm weather, as well as high temperatures in the kitchen and outside. From the increase in the ambient temperature and the heating of the bread machine when kneading the dough, it makes the dough more liquid and softer than required by the rules of the bun.

4. During kneading, grains, bran, dried fruits, raisins, soaked in liquid the day before, were added to the dough, which gave an additional amount of moisture.

5. During kneading, more fruits and vegetables, chopped or grated, were added to the dough than was required to form a bun, and these products were added at the very beginning of the dough kneading, and were ground to a fine state with a kneading knife.

6. When kneading the dough, too much food was added and the bread maker was unable to knead the dough. There was little space for the dough piece, the kneading blade could not cope with kneading a large number of products.

7.When kneading, too much butter was put into the dough, butter in pieces, fatty foods that are also liquid. From the heating of the bread maker during kneading, hard fats become soft and give excess moisture to the dough.

8. When kneading the dough, low-quality flour, ground from sprouted or frosty grain, was laid. Therefore, flour and bread contain a lot of water-soluble substances, a large amount of starch, and due to hydrolysis, there is a lot of water in bread.

9. When kneading the dough, flour of high humidity was used.

3. Incorrect selection of the baking program, extended proofing time of the dough.

If in the first two cases, the dough smells of yeast and the crumb is very wet or wet, then in this case the crumb is baked, the bread is porous and tasty, and the dome of the bread has collapsed downward, and sometimes a rush of dough is formed on the bucket along the edges. And there may be a slight taste and / or smell of leaven.
The reason is the wrong selection of the bread baking program or the dough has stood still during the proofing.

1. Incorrect selection of the baking program. For example, wheat dough should rise for a certain time, sufficient to double the dough, but if the dough has been in the oven for a much longer time, it has already risen, but continues to rise - at some stage it drops sharply, that is, it has stopped and lost its strength, overactive.
The same cases can occur with wheat-rye and rye bread, when the time allotted for proofing by the bread-making program does not correspond to the actual time, the requirements of the dough itself.

2. Temperature of the environment, premises. When proving the dough, pay attention to the conditions in which the dough is proving. The optimum ambient temperature should be at the level of 26-28 * C. At the same time, you need to pay attention to the temperature inside the dough, if it rises, then the dough will grow faster and at some point may settle and lose its shape. This is an important point: the correspondence of the proofing time of the dough (up to a doubling) and the proofing temperature (26-28 * C).
This issue is discussed in more detail in the topic. How to check if the dough is ready for baking? Finished dough temperature

4. Increased temperature inside the x / oven during proofing of the dough.

Many bread bakers sin with this quality, the temperature inside the bucket during the proofing of the dough reaches 35-40 * C - which is very undesirable for the dough. This speeds up the process of raising the dough, and very high, sometimes to the very top of the bucket, but has a bad effect on the quality of the bread when baking or already ready.

It is optimal that the temperature of the dough proofing passes at T * 25-28 and no more!
At the same time, it is optimal for the dough piece to increase by about 2-2.5 times - and no more !!!

L. I, Auerman wrote that when the fermentation temperature rises above 25 degrees, the rheological properties of the dough significantly deteriorate. In simple terms, the dough liquefies, retains its shape worse, gluten is noticeably weakened. And even worse, fermentation in a bread maker affects the dough, where fermentation is accompanied by heating to 40 degrees.

If the dough liquefies, then it is difficult for it to keep its shape, and sometimes it settles during proving or during baking.
Related material here: How to check if the dough is ready for baking? Finished dough temperature

Admin
Quote: pivo

I'm sorry ... I wrote it wrong ..
in my recipes everything is in glasses, sometimes it doesn’t work, but how to read in grams?

Look for answers here:

Number of main ingredients (products) in one measuring cup (240 ml) and one measuring spoon. (post 3)
#

Recalculation of the number of ingredients in the bread recipe. To help beginners.
https://Mcooker-enn.icdself.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=7646.new#new

The amount of flour and other ingredients for making bread of various sizes.
https://Mcooker-enn.icdself.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=1625.0

Admin

"The baker's talent lies in his sense of touch, in the ability to determine the consistency of the dough by touch" Jean-Luc Pujoran (French baker)
Admin
Quote: Lily

turned out even worse ... did not rise like a brick at all ...

You should never strictly add or subtract liquid! Only the dough itself knows how much liquid it needs today, in a given batch! The dough will tell you how much liquid you need to add!

We go to this topic and carefully study the topics on the links Bread again did not work, I did everything strictly according to the recipe. What can be wrong? https://Mcooker-enn.icdself.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=146942.0

We study the Manual especially carefully #, and especially that part, which describes the state of the test during kneading Topic 7. FORMATION OF A TEST WORKPIECE - "BOX". #

Everything is important in this MANUAL! And the description is given in great detail!
Admin
Quote: Shuka4


But here's another thing that interests me. Please tell me whether the fact that at the time of adding the ingredients everything was done strictly according to the recipe can affect the kneading and baking (that is, first dry (flour, salt, sugar, etc.), and then wet ingredients). Maybe that's why everything that remained at the bottom and where the water did not get, remained there? Just flour, a good half of the bread turned out with a height of only 8-10 cm (((

You don't have to do everything strictly according to the recipe! You need to work out the consistency of bread dough, feel it, choose the flour-liquid balance.
And you can bake bread without scales, using only measuring dishes

Come here and learn:
The amount of flour and other ingredients for making bread of various sizes
UNDERSTANDING BREAD IN HOMEMADE BREAD
The easiest white bread made from wheat flour
Wheat flour gingerbread man (master class)

We take bread recipes from the forum, they are almost all tested
Igor777
Wanted a bread maker, very disappointed ... Controliro all processes can be carried out only with manual kneading and baking in the oven, especially when working with starter cultures. A machine is a machine, but active participation is more important, and therefore bread becomes more valuable and tastier. It remains to throw the bulky contraption out of the kitchen ...
Accomplishment
Good morning!
Control
Quote: Igor777
all processes
only those who wants control all processes. Those who do not want to - work out the technology on some recipe (one, second, third - according to needs) and sleep peacefully while the bread maker bakes bread on its own at a given time in the morning.
Sourdough bread, yes, requires more participation - only those who wants... But even here manual kneading is completely optional.
If you want help - formulate the question and the reason for the disappointment specifically.
Or just want to "talk about it"?
Olga 85
Good day! I am a beginner, I just bought a Gemlux GL-BM-789 bread maker, tried to make two white and wheat-rye breads, as a result, the tops of both fell off. The first white on French pastries according to this recipe:
240 ml. warm water (45 degrees),
2 tbsp. tablespoons of sugar
1.5 tsp dry yeast,
4 tablespoons of sunflower oil,
1.5 teaspoons of salt and 3 cups of sifted flour.
Choosing the program "French bread for 750 gr
The bread was baked well, but the top fell off.
And the second one made wheat-rye according to this recipe:
Water 270 ml,
Rye flour 150 g,
Wheat flour 250 g,
Honey 1 tbsp
Vegetable oil 2 tablespoons,
Yeast 1.5 tsp,
Salt 1.5 tsp
For 750g on the program, whole grain bread with a dark crust. As a result, everything was fine when raised, but at the end of the second proofing, the dough began to fall off, while baking, the top fell even more. And the result is not a dark crust, although it seems to be baked, but a little dull, and the top is strongly dented. What could be the problem? Yeast use saf moment. I watched the video from the kolobok, everything seemed to work out well for me.
Admin

First of all, we learn to knead the dough for bread.

Help section Contents of the section "Basics of kneading and baking" and open the topics for kneading dough MASTER CLASSES for kneading the dough (BOLS)

It will definitely work out.

Try baking on Easy Basic (Basic) mode to get started.
Newbie
Quote: Olga 85
but at the end of the second proofing, the dough began to fall off; during baking, the top fell even more. And the result is not a dark crust, although it seems to be baked, but a little dull, and the top is strongly dented. What could be the problem?

You yourself answered - the dough has stopped. Reduce yeast or change the program to "shorter".
Olga 85
Quote: Newbie

You yourself answered - the dough has stopped. Reduce yeast or change the program to "shorter".
I also thought so, but decided to clarify. Thanks, I'll try to put less yeast
Admin
Quote: Newbie
although it seems to be baked, but a little cool

This can happen when the flour-liquid balance is disturbed. The bread is dull - there is more liquid than is needed.

Above, I gave links to where to start baking bread, since a combination of reasons may arise, and not one or two.
Olga 85
Quote: Admin

This can happen when the flour-liquid balance is disturbed. The bread is dull - there is more liquid than is needed.

Above, I gave links to where to start baking bread, since a combination of reasons may arise, and not one or two.
I looked at the master class on the kolobok, I had such. Or maybe the reason is that there is a lot of yeast? In the recipe book for my bread maker, 0.75 tsp is written for 750 g bread. Dry yeast, and I put, as in the recipe, 1.5 tsp.
Admin
The amount of flour and other ingredients for making bread of various sizes

Olga, it was not in vain that I sent you to a special topic on kneading dough - correct dough mixing
And there are also quite a few additional topics related to kneading and baking.

Try it, learn to understand the test, the first time it may not work out What can you guess on the coffee grounds

And learn from our notes and developments, they are all tested in practice.
Take recipes from the forum too - they have also been tested.
Olga 85
I'll try again, thanks!
makvar
Good day!
We need expert advice.
Yesterday I baked bread from spelled flour (100%) - the top fell almost to the bottom!
The recipe has been proven over the years. I used it to bake it from both VS flour and whole grain flour - everything worked out.
The roads are dry, strong - Saft Moment.
I read it on the Internet, they write that spelled (spelled) has weak gluten, you need to mix it with ordinary wheat flour 50/50. (By the way, spelled and spelled ARE DIFFERENT PRODUCTS! Spelled is the progenitor of hard grain, and spelled is soft).
At the expense of gluten - I do not agree, because this spelled flour contains 29-30% of it, the IDC is about 80. And wheat flour has gluten in the region of 24%. As for "weak" gluten or "strong" - I do not know such a term, maybe they mean the quality of gluten, so this is the IDK (it is normal).
But I made a new batch - 50/50% with wheat sun. The bread has already turned out, you can eat. But the top still sank from the horizon by about 2-3 cm.
Who experimented with spelled - share, plz, the results. What are its features and why such results?
Thanks to everyone who responded!
Admin
Spelled and spelled bread is always excellent.
Use the search on the forum and there will be many recipes - study and bake
https://Mcooker-enn.icdself.com/se... eb%20 of%20

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